HN 写作课

工程师们二十年里聊过的写作。

工程师、作家、编辑和创业者在 Hacker News 上聊了二十年“怎么写”:怎么写得清楚、怎么讲好一个故事、技术文档怎么写、小说和出版是怎么回事。这里把其中关于写作与讲故事的帖子挑出来,配上中文导读、可以直接用的写作要点和评论翻译。

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    1. 01

      从全量里捞

      读取 Hacker News 自 2006 年以来的全部帖子,用关键词先捞出 40 分以上、可能和写作有关的约 1.1 万篇。

    2. 02

      只留真正讲写作的

      由 AI 逐条判断是否和写作、讲故事、文风、出版有实质关系,剔除“写代码”“编辑器”这类字面撞车,并分进十个类别。

    3. 03

      提炼可用的要点

      为值得读的帖子写中文导读,提炼 2-4 条可以直接用到自己写作里的要点,并精选翻译 HN 高赞评论。内容由 AI 生成,可能有误。

    讲故事与叙事2021bottomfeeder.substack.com

    关于电子游戏叙事的真相

    Truths about video game stories

    阅读原文 HN 讨论
    248HN 得分
    323条评论
    4条写作要点

    导读

    这篇短文提出若干条关于电子游戏叙事的"真相",核心观点是:游戏极擅长营造世界与场景,却难以承载需要严格节奏控制的情节。评论区围绕"设定强于情节""玩家自创故事还是被喂故事""业界讲故事的标准是否偏低"展开争论,对写作者理解叙事节奏、留白与模板化风险很有参考价值。

    关键词 游戏叙事世界观设定叙事节奏玩家自主性

    可以直接用的写作要点

    1. 01

      先把世界写厚:设定、氛围、细节可以撑起整部作品,情节反而允许极简。

    2. 02

      节奏是叙事的命门,重要信息与转折要按节拍安排,不要被中途插入的动作或闲笔随意打断。

    3. 03

      给读者留出自己"演绎"的空间,比把一切讲透更能留下深刻记忆。

    4. 04

      警惕"换皮模板":如果剥掉细节后只剩"坏人涌出、英雄杀光、直捣巢穴",说明原创性其实藏在装饰里而非骨架上。

    HN 评论精选

    游戏强于"世界"弱于"情节",因为互动会破坏叙事所需的节奏控制。

    很多游戏情节单薄甚至几乎没有,但设定惊人。我不确定游戏是否真是讲情节的好载体:游戏是互动的,而好情节需要精心控制的节奏与时机。你当然可以强行塞进去,但越这么做,游戏就越像一部可互动的电影。《黑暗之魂》就是例子:设定惊人,情节却极简——"你是被选中的不死人,去收集若干物品",而它的世界足够写满好几本书。这有点像拿好新闻和好故事作类比:好故事不能纯靠事实,因为那会打断叙事需求(节奏、善恶、道德抉择、失败与胜利);新闻里的"叙事"只是事实的串连,作用是说明这些事实为何相关。游戏同理:情节被玩家的行动不断打断——比如《风之杖》里你要救妹妹,但实际玩家在岛上乱跑、砸罐子、做支线。情节几乎成了支线,只为玩家行动提供背景。

    everdrive查看英文原文

    Many video games have very poor or bare plots, but amazing settings. In fact, I'm not sure that video games are actually good vehicles for plots. Video games are interactive, but all good plots require careful pacing and timing in order to be successful. It's possible to force this in a game, but the more you do, the more the game becomes an interactive movie. A great example would be Dark Souls: incredible setting, but really bare-bones plot. The plot is effectively: "You're the chosen undead, and you must quest for some items." The setting, on the other hand, could fill books. In some sense, it's similar to comparing a good news article to a good story. A good story. Good story generally can't be purely fact-based, since this interrupts the needs of narrative: pacing, good vs. evil, moral decisions, defeats, and victories, etc. A good news story may have something like a narrative, but it's more of a collection of facts. If there's an narrative at all, it exists simply to help explain the relevance of the facts presented. Video games are metaphorically similar: You may have an interesting plot in the game, but it is punctuated by the actions you get to take as a player. For example, in Wind Waker you must rescue your sister, but in practice the player is running around an island, breaking pots, and doing sidequests. The narrative plot and the play actions are almost totally disparate. The plot is nearly a side story, which helps add context to the player actions.

    玩家更珍视自己创造的故事,作者化的过场与灌输越少越好。

    我持相反立场。游戏里的故事就是我必须快速点掉、好进入下一段动作的东西——"是是是,blablabla",点点点,不关心。我的理想是自己创造故事,而不是被喂故事:给我一个角色和开放世界,让我想干什么干什么;适度引导可以,越少越好。GTA3 的剧情我几乎记不得,只记得为了解锁城区硬啃剧情,但开车满城乱撞、在第三个岛上反复飞滑雪跳台——这些记忆鲜明且珍视。为此我特别喜欢程序生成:在《无人深空》里找到千分之一的那颗行星并独自探索、截图,明知可能只有我会来访,那种感觉太棒了。另一个问题(有了孩子后更明显):很多游戏在动作层面我完全能让孩子玩,但因为剧情、主要是过场动画而不能。动作本身并不需要那么出格,剧情似乎只是为了显得"有态度"。

    BashiBazouk查看英文原文

    I'd be in the opposite camp. Video game stories are those things I have to quickly click through to get to the next bit of action. Ya, ya, ya, bla, bla, bla, click, click click, don't care. My ideal is to create my own story rather than have it spoon fed to me. Let me roll a character then let me do what I want in an interactive open world. Sure, some curating and minor direction is OK, but the less the better. I don't remember much of the story of GTA 3 other than slogging through it to open the city up but surfing a car all over town causing mayhem or endlessly jumping the ski jump on the third island, those are the memories of that game I remember vividly and cherish. To enhance this I absolutely love good procedural generation. Finding that one out of a thousand planet in No Mans Sky and just exploring it, taking screen shots knowing that I'm likely the only person who will ever visit it, wonderful. The other problem with modern video game stories I notice now that I have a kid: there are plenty of video games that action wise I have no problem letting my kid play but can't due to the story and mainly the cut scenes. Seems to be a path to some edgy cred when the base action does not really justify it.

    很多被赞"剧情好"的游戏只是通用模板加细节装饰,行业标准偏低。

    我记得当年媒体一致盛赞初代《半条命》的剧情,我很意外——它和从《毁灭战士》以来的所有第一人称射击游戏是同一个故事:坏蛋从跨维度传送门涌出大开杀戒,主角必须杀光他们,并穿过传送门去干掉外星首领。有一些很酷的附加细节——G-Man、作为第三方的海军陆战队介入、中途跑去发射导弹之类——但这些都是在同一个基本故事之上的附加物。作者说得对:我们对游戏讲故事的标准确实很低。

    aynsof查看英文原文

    I remember all the press praising the original Half Life for its story. I was really surprised - it was the same story as all first person shooters going back to Doom: Bad guys spawn across an inter-dimensional portal and start wreaking havoc. Protagonist has to kill them all, crossing the portal in the process to go destroy the alien leader. There were some cool extra details - the G Man, the marines entering as a third force, the diversions to do things like launch a missile into space - but all of those things were additional to that same, basic story. This author has it spot on: our standards for story telling in video games are really low.

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